Spurned by Hollywood and the legacy press, the online right has spent more than a decade forging its own alternative media ecosystem out of the void conservative talk radio left behind. In 2024, podcasts like the Joe Rogan Experience became some of its most powerful electoral weapons.
It’s difficult to know for certain whether Rogan’s endorsement of Donald Trump contributed to Kamala Harris’ loss—though it’s unlikely to have hurt Trump’s chances—but the episode has had a demonstrable effect on Democrats’ priorities. Since Trump swept the election and sent Democrats spinning for an answer as to why, Democrats have pointed to Rogan specifically, and the right’s digital media ecosystem more broadly, as something the party ought to replicate.
“Part of the work for these next four years is to dig into an ever changing informational environment and build relationships with folks that are communicating effectively across that landscape,” says Ben Wikler, Wisconsin Democratic Party chairman and one of the top candidates to lead the DNC. “There's been people advocating for this kind of changed approach for years, but it's time to make this a central part of our strategy.”
Speaking with WIRED, though, some creators and Democratic strategists argued that it wasn’t the party’s creator strategy that lost them the election, but the lack of any real message for creators to deliver to their audiences.
“If Democrats are going to be the party of working people, they actually have to stand up to corporations,” says Rynn Reed, the founder of Creator Congress. “Political creators, much like elected representatives, have to answer for their public stances. The Democrats make that impossible when they give creators nothing to defend.”
The online messengers Democrats need to engage with will not always align perfectly to the party platform, Wikler suggested. Democrats criticized members of their party for engaging with what many consider problematic creators in the past. Bernie Sanders, a 2020 presidential candidate, sat for an hourlong interview with Rogan; the Human Rights Campaign, a Democratic-aligned LGBTQ advocacy group, then said it was “disappointed” Sanders had accepted Rogan’s endorsement, given controversial statements he had made related to trans athletes. Four years later, Democrats are kicking themselves for not making time for Harris to record with Rogan in his Austin, Texas, studio.
“A lot of creators saw the writing on the wall, but the campaign didn’t seem interested in their expertise–only their platform,” says Reed. Her group, Creator Congress, seeks to train creators interested in politics on how to communicate with their audiences
There are models for this sort of project, among them Turning Point USA, an incubator for conservative online talent. Since at least 2020, the right-wing student organization has trained hundreds of conservative creators, flying them out to conferences all across the country for seminars on how to build a digital media career. Some of the party’s most influential voices have come out of the Turning Point USA organization, like Isabel Brown and Candace Owens, who both host news and commentary shows with millions of subscribers.
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While Democrats spent record amounts on influencer marketing in the 2024 cycle, a majority of the partnerships materialized in the three months before the election. The political creator management group Social Currant shared data with WIRED showing that 70 percent of all of their creator partnerships took place from August through November. Nearly all of the organizations the group has worked with, at 89 percent, have paused all spending on creators. Eighty-one percent of all resources that passed through Social Currant paid for “one-off” social posts instead of building long-term relationships between organizations and creators.
One of the crucial differences between the right- and left-leaning media ecosystems is the right’s willingness to “get on board,” as Jon Lovett, Pod Save America cohost, told the progressive creator Hasan Piker in a podcast interview late last month. While conservatives intensely debate whether it’s a good idea, the movement generally holds to the policy of “No enemies to the right.” From the beginning, Turning Point trainers insisted that there could be no infighting among creators, especially if it was public-facing. At a 2021 training, Turning Point USA founder Charlie Kirk—himself a podcast host—begged influencers to stop arguing with each other online. “No one really cares,” he said. “Nobody wants to see it. If it’s a private messaging service, you guys can do that.”
Unlike the right, the left loudly eats its own—for many of its factions, “Only enemies to the left” would be a decent working description of policy. Despite Piker’s massive reach with disaffected young voters, he was, he says, “politely” kicked out of the Democratic National Convention after interviewing members of the Uncommitted movement at the convention center. At the time, the Uncommitted group was lobbying for a pro-Palestinian Democrat to speak at the convention. They were ultimately denied a speaking spot.
Perhaps in part due to this strategy of exclusion, the audiences Republicans reached were far more engaged with the content than Democratic viewers. A recent study from People First and Infegy found that conservative-leaning podcasts hosted by figures like Rogan and Theo Von recently had anywhere from 25 to 33 percent higher engagement compared to shows that Harris went on, like Call Her Daddy.
The influencers who interviewed Trump this cycle were not political creatures. Rogan and Von grew their audiences out of their comedy (and, in Rogan’s case, sports) careers and from within the entertainment industry. Their ideologies are amorphous, attracting a variety of viewers across the political spectrum. Both Von and Rogan interviewed Trump, but they also recorded conversations with progressive lawmakers like Sanders, which made it easier for each of them to avoid pigeonholing themselves with either party and consequently boosted trust among their audiences.
“The floor has absolutely collapsed with the Democratic Party’s brand online,” says Brock. “People who don’t care about politics don’t like us. People who care about and work in politics don’t know how to represent us. We are seen as completely out of touch, and as more folks turn to unconventional methods to get their news and media, we are set up for a colossal failure going forward without a strategy shift.”
In the wake of Democrats’ defeat last month, progressive critics of the mainstream media launched startup media ventures of their own or are seeking new funding. Amelia Montooth, the CEO of Mutuals Media, argues that Democrats need their own culture-focused shows online.
“The right has a funnel that I believe starts with Barstool Sports that reaches a mass audience via pop culture,” says Montooth. “It will require some serious investment not only from people like the progressive party, but also from individual people who care about that work and journalism.”
It will also require risk-taking—something Democrats, a party currently led by an 82-year-old man, are known to avoid.
“Sticking to the same five talking points isn’t going to land you a real viral moment, and one viral moment doesn’t matter if it doesn’t translate into a larger movement going forward,” says Brock. “Because with critique and ridicule comes engagement, comes conversation, inspires folks to defend you and evangelizes others to come to your aid.”
